Knowledgebase

My bees are gone #751367

Asked May 21, 2021, 5:33 PM EDT

Megan, We installed our first NUC on 4/25/2021, By May 8 the hive was looking weak but still had bees and I believe new eggs, larva, capped brood, etc. By May 13 most of bees were gone except a few dead in the bottom. Any ideas?

Ingham County Michigan

Expert Response

Thanks for the pictures - It is really hard to say, without being there/ seeing the hive.  They definately were not short on protein.  

1) Was it a 5 frame nuc that you installed into a 8 or 10 frame hive? 

2) When you installed, you just transferred all the frames, keeping the new hive open?  And did the process go smoothly? Did you see the queen? 

3) were you feeding syrup?  Did you have the patties on their the whole time? 

4) There are three photos of one side of one brood frame.  What was on the rest of the frames (There should be 10 sides to look at, and we see 2)? I don't need photos of all, but descriptions would be good, or another photo of a brood frame?

5) What do you mean by "looking weak?". It is really useful to report "frames of bees," or an example of cluster size (e.g."softball size cluster").

6) This is the big one: What do you mean "I believe" new eggs and larvae?  This woudl really be the one that answers a lot - when the last time you saw the queen, and signs of her laying. If you really did see here/ good eggs on the 8th,then that would be very different. 

 One thing I am thinking of is that the queen got damaged in transport/ transfer - in which case, you would only see capped brood by this point, and the bees could have left to join your package hive. 

The other reasons that I have seen nucs abscond are heat (they got too crowded), starvation ( I can't tell if there is nectar/ syrup in the frames), or really bad disease. It could also be a pesticide issue, but that his hard to tell.  

My questions above will help look into the queen/ heat/ food first. 

An Ask Extension Expert Replied May 23, 2021, 1:17 AM EDT

Thanks for the quick reply.

 

My answers below in red: We would live to come in and look at some of our pictures we have to see if we are identifying them correctly. We live in Mason, are you at MSU campus?

 

Chuck Golden

CEO

Green Dealer Support

<personal data hidden>

Off: <personal data hidden>

Cell:<personal data hidden>

P Before printing this e-mail, please consider the environment

 

 

From: Ask Extension <<personal data hidden>>
Sent: Sunday, May 23, 2021 1:17 AM
To: chuck greendealersupport.com <<personal data hidden>>
Subject: Re: My bees are gone (#0021298)

 

The Question Asker Replied May 23, 2021, 11:14 PM EDT

I think that your email was cut off - I don't see any responses in red.  

We aren't set up to do house calls, unfortunately. I agree that it would be a great service, and I'd love for us to have the resources for us to hire someone to allow us to take on that role.  

An Ask Extension Expert Replied May 24, 2021, 4:06 AM EDT

Thanks for the pictures - It is really hard to say, without being there/ seeing the hive. They definitely were not short on protein.

1) Was it a 5 frame nuc that you installed into an 8 or 10 frame hive? It was a 5 frame nuc going into a 10 frame hive. We put the new frames from the nuc between the hive's existing frames.

2) When you installed, you just transferred all the frames, keeping the new hive open? And did the process go smoothly? Did you see the queen? We did not see the queen during the transfer process. We knew we were looking for a much larger bee but never actually saw her. We thought the transfer went smoothly. It was quick

3) were you feeding syrup? Did you have the patties on there the whole time? We installed the nuc on April 25 and a Boardman sugar-water feeder on 4/26. We started the patties about a week later. Here is a picture of bees arriving with pollen on 4/26

4) There are three photos of one side of one brood frame. What was on the rest of the frames (There should be 10 sides to look at, and we see 2)? I don't need photos of all, but descriptions would be good, or another photo of a brood frame? I am no sure I have both sides but here is what I have from 5-8:

Frame 5

Frame 6

Frame 7

Frames 1,2,3,9 and 10 were all empty

5) What do you mean by "looking weak?". It is really useful to report "frames of bees," or an example of cluster size (e.g." softball size cluster"). By “looking weak” I meant we were seeing almost no activity at the entrance as compared to the “package bee” hive and the number of bees on the frames appeared to be much less than when we transferred. As you can see in the pictures above there were some bees on just a couple of frames

6) This is the big one: What do you mean "I believe" new eggs and larvae? This would really be the one that answers a lot - when the last time you saw the queen, and signs of her laying. If you really did see here/ good eggs on the 8th, then that would be very different. I believe we saw eggs on the 8th but maybe seeing a reflection

The Question Asker Replied May 24, 2021, 12:50 PM EDT

Sorry about the delay - I thought that I had sent out the last response, but the draft was just sitting there.  

I also don't have great information for you, and part of that is it is just hard to tell sometimes without seeing/ knowing what is happening in the colony.   The photos don't allow us to see into the brood cells, so it is really hard to tell when the last time they were queen right.   I think for your beekeeping, I would make sure that you are good at identifying whether a colony is queen right - meaning if there are eggs.  This is a really important, and can help answer a lot of questions, or rule out a queen issue.  

The spotted brood pattern is concerning, but it is hard to tell if it is the cause of the loss, or happened after they left (and brood started to die).  

I would melt down the wax on the frames from that hive, and hopefully you can make some nice splits from your other hives later in the season. 

An Ask Extension Expert Replied June 06, 2021, 5:24 AM EDT

Thanks for your reply,

 

I know it is hard to tell what happened without having all the information you needed or seeing it firsthand.

 

Here is what happened since.

  • I took out 3 of the frames with comb and replaced them with empty frames that I sprayed with sugar water
  • I bought a Swarm Commander Lure and put it in the hive to make that my trap
  • I put a few drops of Lemongrass extract around the entrance and left the cotton ball in the bottom of the hive
  • I moved the empty hive to the top of a 10 foot high stump in the woods about 200 feet from the original hive location
  • Within 2 days I had a lot of bees at my trap location and with 3 days had what looked like 1000’s
  • I let that continue for a 5 days and the numbers seemed to continue to build
  • I checked late at night 11:00 PM and they all seemed to be inside so I installed the screen over the entrance to keep them all inside
  • By 6:30 AM the next morning I had a few bees outside the hive
  • By noon I had what I believe was 1000’s coating the outside of my hive/trap
  • I used a plastic trash bag to capture as many as I could and moved this collection back to the original hive location (we had a lot of upset bees swarming around us as we moved them) (I only got stung twice)
  • We set the hive back to its original location, draped a couple of pine tree branches over the front of the hive
  • We had a huge bunch of bees that had followed us or were in the trash bag that were all swarming around the hive
  • After a hour or so we removed the screen from the opening
  • A few bees seemed to be coming out initially but then we had a lot that had been on the outside going in
  • By early the next morning 99% were inside or gone (they were not outside the hive)
  • I checked in the woods and the entire top 12 inches of this 2 foot wide stump where I had set the trap was covered with bees ( I would guess a couple of thousand)
  • By the next day the number was much smaller, I would guess 300 and by yesterday a mass of about 200
  • Meanwhile back at the hive there was a flurry of activity with bees coming and going with many carrying pollen into the hive
  • I think my trap and relocation worked as it has been 2 days now and the activity is brisk.
  • I am eager to look inside to see what is happening but I anticipate comp being built and hope to soon see some evidence of egg laying

 

Sorry for the long explanation but I was eager to share my story.

 

I think I may build another trap and put it on top of my 10 foot high stump and see if I can catch some additional bees

 

Chuck Golden

CEO

Green Dealer Support

<personal data hidden>

Off: <personal data hidden>

Cell:<personal data hidden>

P Before printing this e-mail, please consider the environment

 

 

From: Ask Extension <<personal data hidden>>
Sent: Sunday, June 6, 2021 5:25 AM
To: chuck greendealersupport.com <<personal data hidden>>
Subject: Re: My bees are gone (#0021298)

 

The Question Asker Replied June 06, 2021, 8:56 AM EDT

I'm so glad that you responded!  What a great outcome to the sad start to your season. 

An Ask Extension Expert Replied June 07, 2021, 5:13 AM EDT

Loading ...